Detail View: RIT/NTID Deaf Studies Archive: Creating original ASL poetry

Filename: 
ds_0049_graybill_cap_01.mp4
Identifier: 
ds_0049_graybill_cap_01.mp4
Title: 
Creating original ASL poetry
Creator: 
Graybill, Patrick
Subject: 
American Sign Language literature
Subject: 
Deaf Poetry
Subject: 
Poetry Authorship
Subject: 
American poetry 20th century
Subject: 
Deaf, Writings of the, American
Subject: 
ASL poetry
Summary: 
Graybill discusses creating original ASL poetry in this lecture. Before he begins the lecture, he presents an outline of topics he will cover: a history of what he saw as Deaf poetry when growing up, what Deaf poets are doing with original ASL poetry, six features of ASL, performing examples of his poetry and what will happen to ASL poetry in the future. When he grew up in the Kansas School for the Deaf, he saw hearing and Deaf teachers and students reading English poetry which was then translated to ASL. Most of the people writing poetry were born hearing, and then became Deaf, like Robert Panara. Panara wrote English poetry, such as "On My Deafness" which was then translated it to ASL. Other Deaf poets like Panara are Rex Lowman and Loy Golladay.
Publisher: 
National Technical Institute for the Deaf
Digital Publisher: 
Rochester Institute of Technology - RIT Libraries - RIT Archive Collections
Date of Original: 
1991
Date of Digitization: 
2018
Broad Type: 
moving image
Digital File Format: 
mp4
Physical Format: 
VHS
Dimensions of Original: 
49 minutes
Language: 
American Sign Language
Language: 
English
Original Item Location: 
RITDSA.0049
Library Collection: 
Sculptures in the Air: An Accessible Online Video Repository of the American Sign Language (ASL) Poetry and Literature Collections
Library Collection: 
ASL Lecture Series DVDs
Digital Project: 
2018-2019 CLIR Grant-ASL Poetry and Literature
Catalog Record: 
https://albert.rit.edu/record=b3955820
Catalog Record: 
https://twcarchivesspace.rit.edu/repositories/2/resources/837
Place: 
New York - Rochester
RIT Spaces and Places: 
Henrietta Campus
Rights: 
RIT Libraries makes materials from its collections available for educational and research purposes pursuant to U.S. Copyright Law. You are free to use this Item in any way that is permitted by the copyright and related rights legislation that applies to your use. It is your responsibility to obtain permission from the copyright holder to publish or reproduce images in print or electronic form.
Rights: 
CC BY-NC-ND: Attribution NonCommercial NoDerivatives 4.0 International
Transcript: 
PRESENTER TODAY IS PATRICK GRAYBILL. MIC IS NOT-- ONLY IN THE EARPHONES. THE MICROPHONE IS PRESENT-- IS IN THE SPEAKERS. THE MIC IS NOT SUPPOSED TO BE ON THE SPEAKERS, ONLY ON THE [INDISTINCT], YOU GUYS. - OK. IT'S-- - [INDISTINCT] WILL SOMEBODY GO BACK UP HERE AND KNOCK ON THE DOOR? PATRICK GRADUATED FROM GALLAUDET UNIVERSITY AND GOT HIS BACHELOR'S IN ENGLISH. HE GOT HIS MASTER'S DEGREE IN DEAF EDUCATION, ALSO FROM GALLAUDET UNIVERSITY. HE TAUGHT GRADUATE SCHOOL AT THE KENDALL SCHOOL... AND THEN JOINED NTD, THE NATIONAL THEATER OF THE DEAF. HE WAS ONE OF THE FOUNDING MEMBERS IN THAT THEATER COMPANY. HE'S BEEN A PROFESSIONAL ACTOR FOR MANY YEARS AND HAS TRAVELED THROUGHOUT THE UNITED STATES AND ALL OVER THE WORLD, ACTUALLY. MOST RECENTLY, HE'S BEEN WRITING AND WORKING ON ASL POETRY. HIS TOPIC TODAY... IS CREATING POETRY IN ASL. PLEASE GIVE A WARM WELCOME TO PATRICK GRAYBILL, ORIGINAL POETRY IN ASL. THANK YOU. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. ARE THE LIGHTS ALL RIGHT? IS EVERYONE ABLE TO SEE ME? MY-- [LAUGHTER] TOP OF MY HEAD TOO SHINY OR ARE WE ALL RIGHT HERE? ALL RIGHT. SUSAN FISCHER, WHO JUST INTRODUCED ME, I NEED TO EXPLAIN THAT MY TOPIC IS ORIGINAL POETRY IN ASL, BUT I'M TELLING YOU, I CAN'T WRITE POETRY IN ASL. SHE USED THE SIGN "WRITE," AND THAT IS NOT WHAT I DO. I SIGN POETRY IN AMERICAN SIGN LANGUAGE. I WANTED TO START OUR PRESENTATION AT 1:05 AND IT'S 1:12 ALREADY. I'M AFRAID WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO TAKE AWAY SOME OF THE--SOME OF MY TOPIC TODAY, BECAUSE WE NEED TO LEAVE AT 2. WELL, I'LL FIGURE OUT HOW TO HANDLE THAT AS WE GO ALONG. FIRST, I WOULD LIKE TO EXPLAIN WHAT I'M DOING TODAY. I HAVE AN INTRODUCTION TO MY PRESENTATION AND THEN I WILL GO INTO THE HISTORY, AS I WAS GROWING UP, WHAT I SAW IN DEAF POETRY, AND WHAT DEAF POETS WERE DOING. WHAT THEY WERE DOING WITH THEIR OWN ORIGINAL POETRY. I'LL JUST HAVE A BRIEF SUMMARY OF THE HISTORY OF THAT AS I'VE SEEN IT IN MY UPBRINGING. ALSO, I'LL DISCUSS THE FEATURES OF ASL. WE'LL DISCUSS--I WON'T GO INTO DEPTH ON THOSE, BUT I WILL DISCUSS THOSE BRIEFLY. THERE ARE 6 DIFFERENT FEATURES. AFTER THAT, I WILL PRESENT ONE OF MY OWN ORIGINAL PIECES, AND WE CAN ANALYZE THAT TOGETHER, THAT POEM. AND LAST, I WILL BE DISCUSSING WHAT I PREDICT FOR THE FUTURE IN ASL POETRY. I HOPE WE'LL HAVE 5 MINUTES LEFT SO WE CAN HAVE QUESTIONS AND ANSWERS. THAT'S MY EXPECTATION. BEFORE WORLD WAR II, I WAS BORN, AND I DON'T NEED TO TELL YOU MY AGE HERE, BUT IT WAS BEFORE WORLD WAR II. I GREW UP IN KANSAS, AND THE KANSAS SCHOOL FOR THE DEAF IS WHERE I WAS EDUCATED, AND I SAW MANY TEACHERS AND STUDENTS READING POETRY IN ENGLISH, IN WRITTEN ENGLISH, AND THEN TRY TO TRANSLATE IT TO AMERICAN SIGN LANGUAGE OR TO SIGN IT. SOME WERE HEARING AND SOME DEAF. THEY HAVE--POETRY IN ENGLISH HAS WRITTEN RULES... AND MOST OF THE PEOPLE WHO WERE WRITING POETRY IN AMERICAN SIGN LANGUAGE WERE BORN HEARING AND THEN BECAME DEAF. DO YOU KNOW ROBERT PANARA? HE'S AN EXAMPLE OF SOMEONE WHO WAS WRITING POETRY IN ENGLISH AND THEN TRANSLATING IT TO ASL. ANOTHER MAN IS REX LOHMAN. ALSO LOY GOLLADAY. THESE ARE EXAMPLES OF PROFESSORS-- PROFESSORS EMERITUS. THEY'VE RETIRED SINCE. BUT THERE ARE MANY OTHER POETS AS WELL, DEAF POETS WHO WROTE IN ENGLISH THEIR POETRY. THERE ARE MANY EXAMPLES YOU CAN FIND, AND I WILL NOT...I WON'T BE PRESENTING THAT IN AMERICAN SIGN LANGUAGE, BUT THEY HAVE WRITTEN, AND THEY HAVE SOME DERIVATIVES FROM ASL IN THE POETRY. THIS IS A POEM FROM ROBERT PANARA. THE TITLE IS "ON HIS DEAFNESS." MAYBE YOU HAVE ALREADY SEEN THAT POEM AND LEARNED IT IN ENGLISH, AND YOU SEE IT FOLLOWS THE ENGLISH POETRY RULES. IT HAS RHYTHM, ALLITERATION. THERE ARE THESE KIND OF RULES THAT ARE BEING FOLLOWED IN THIS POEM. YOU NOTICE THE "S"s ARE SOMETHING THAT ARE USED FREQUENTLY IN THE FIRST TWO STANZAS HERE. AND IN POETRY, THE PEOPLE WHO READ THAT POETRY, THEY THINK, "OH, THAT'S WONDERFUL," AND THEN IT'S PRINTED. IT WAS PRINTED IN SILENT NETWORK, SILENT NEWS. IT WAS PUBLISHED IN SEVERAL DIFFERENT MAGAZINES. AND OTHER DEAF PEOPLE WOULD READ IT, AND RESPECT--HAVE MUCH RESPECT FOR ROBERT PANARA FOR WRITING THAT, AND GROWING UP, I THOUGHT, "OH, I WOULD LOVE TO BE LIKE THEM AND BE A POET AND WRITE POETRY," THINKING IT WOULD BE IN ENGLISH. EVEN THOUGH ENGLISH WASN'T MY NATIVE LANGUAGE OR MY FIRST LANGUAGE, I STILL HAD THE GOAL OF WRITING IN ENGLISH, AND I REALIZED WHEN PEOPLE WOULD CORRECT IT, THAT I DIDN'T HAVE THE PROPER ENGLISH IN MY POETRY. I BECAME VERY FRUSTRATED AND DECIDED I WOULD GET MORE INTO ACTING. I WOULD READ AN ENGLISH POEM AND THEN TRANSLATE IT INTO AMERICAN SIGN LANGUAGE. WHEN I--ACTUALLY, IT WASN'T AMERICAN SIGN LANGUAGE. IT WAS SIGNED, BUT IT WAS MORE OF A SIGNED ENGLISH WITH SOME DERIVATIVES OF ASL PRESENTED IN THE POETRY. AND I WOULD INCLUDE THOSE TO HOPEFULLY MAKE IT A CLEARER MESSAGE FROM THE POEM. THIS IS ANOTHER FAMOUS POEM. "RICHARD CORY." AND WHILE I WAS AT GALLAUDET UNIVERSITY, I WENT INTO A--I ENTERED A COMPETITION FOR POETRY, AND THAT WAS IN 1962 OR 1963, I THINK. AND I WAS SIGNING THIS POEM. THE FIRST PARAGRAPH OF THIS POEM. THE TITLE IS "RICHARD CORY." RIGHT. RICHARD CORY WENT DOWNTOWN. WE PEOPLE ON THE PAVEMENT LOOKED AT HIM. HE WAS A GENTLEMAN FROM SOUL TO CROWN. CLEAN FAVORED, AND IMPERIALLY SLIM. SO, I USED SOME SIGNS FROM ASL, BUT I STILL WAS FOLLOWING WORD FOR WORD QUITE ACCURATELY. I DIDN'T CARE TOO MUCH ABOUT THE MEANING. I WANTED PEOPLE TO LOOK AND ENJOY IT. THEY ACCEPTED IT. THEY DIDN'T SEE THE DIFFERENCE. TRANSLATING POETRY... WHEN YOU TRANSLATE IT FOR THE STAGE, POETRY FOR THE STAGE... THERE'S A--THERE'S A POET THAT WAS A STUDENT AT GALLAUDET, AND HE MADE REFERENCE TO HOW YOU TRANSLATE POETRY ONSTAGE. YOU NEED TO SET THINGS UP SO THAT IT'S SORT OF LIKE ALLITERATION IN ENGLISH, AND HE MADE THAT COMPARISON. WE GREW UP TOGETHER AND HE WAS DISCUSSING THIS WITH ME. THEN, IN 1965, WILLIAM STOKOE, WHO WAS THE CHAIRPERSON OF THE ENGLISH DEPARTMENT AT GALLAUDET UNIVERSITY, AND THERE WERE TWO OTHER PEOPLE ALSO. THE THREE OF THEM GOT TOGETHER AND DID SOME RESEARCH ON SIGN LANGUAGE ITSELF, AND THEY ANALYZED THE LANGUAGE, AND THEN THEY SHARED THE INFORMATION WITH PEOPLE ABOUT ASL BEING A REAL LANGUAGE. THAT HAPPENED IN 1965, AND THAT WAS PUBLISHED IN A BOOK CALLED "THE DICTIONARY OF AMERICAN SIGN LANGUAGE." NOW, MANY OTHER PEOPLE AT THAT TIME WERE REALLY AMAZED AT THAT, BECAUSE THEY THOUGHT, WELL, ASL ISN'T LANGUAGE? BUT I WAS AN ENGLISH MAJOR AT THE TIME AND THE CHAIRPERSON OF MY DEPARTMENT ACTUALLY ANNOUNCED THAT ASL WAS A LANGUAGE IN ITS OWN RIGHT, AND I THOUGHT ABOUT THAT, AND I THOUGHT ABOUT ASL, AND I THOUGHT BEFORE THAT IT WAS GOOD FOR DORMITORY LIFE OR... BUT NOT REALLY APPROPRIATE TO USE ONSTAGE. AND IT REALLY TOOK ME YEARS AND YEARS TO UNDERSTAND WHAT HE WAS SAYING, BUT IN 1965 ONWARD, WILLIAM STOKOE, HIS WORK REALLY INFLUENCED THE DEAF COMMUNITY, AND MANY PEOPLE AFTER THAT, AFTER 1965, BECAME VERY PROUD OF THEIR OWN LANGUAGE. HE WAS A PROFESSOR OF ENGLISH HIMSELF, BUT HE REALLY ENCOURAGED ALL THE STUDENTS AT GALLAUDET UNIVERSITY TO BECOME MORE CREATIVE IN USING ASL WITH THEIR POETRY. SO, AROUND 1970... ELLA MAE LENTZ, WHO WAS ANOTHER STUDENT, BECAME VERY INSPIRED AND BEGAN TO BECOME VERY CREATIVE WITH ASL, AND THEN IN 1980, AROUND 1980, THERE WERE MORE AND MORE CONFERENCES HELD ALL OVER THE UNITED STATES WHERE DEAF PEOPLE WERE INVITED TO COME AND PRESENT THEIR POETRY IN ASL. FOR EXAMPLE, BERNAR-- IN BERKELEY, CALIFORNIA, THEY HAD AN ANNUAL EVENT CALLED "A CELEBRATION," "A CELEBRATION," WHERE THEY INVITED ELLA MAE LENTZ, AND SHE WENT AND PRESENTED, AND I FLEW THERE AT THE TIME, AND I ALSO PRESENTED MY POEMS, MY BEGINNING POEMS IN ASL. AND THAT HAPPENED ON FEBRUARY 1 IN 1984. IT WAS A VERY BIG DAY FOR ME BECAUSE OTHER PEOPLE WERE INVOLVED, TOO, BUT NTID, WHICH WAS OVER AT ONE SIDE OF THE COAST, AND CALIFORNIA--WELL, NTID AT THE TIME WAS HERE. THERE WAS A FAMOUS AMERICAN POET CALLED ALLEN GINSBERG, WHO WAS A HEARING MAN, AND ALSO BOB PANARA. THE TWO OF THEM GOT TOGETHER AND THEY HAD INVITED A LARGE GROUP OF PEOPLE, A LARGE GROUP OF PEOPLE CAME TO SEE THEIR PRESENTATION, AND THEY TALKED ABOUT POETRY AND ITS MEANING, AND I WAS IN THE AUDIENCE AT THE TIME WATCHING THEIR PRESENTATION, AND ALLEN SHOWED ONE POEM FROM A BOOK WHICH WAS CALLED "THE OWL." "THE OWL." AND HE HAD WRITTEN IT OUT ON THE BLACKBOARD, TWO WORDS. "JUKE BOX." ONE OF THE WORDS WAS "JUKE BOX," AND I LOOKED AT THE TWO WORDS AT THE TIME, AND I REALLY WASN'T TOO SURE WHY HE WROTE THAT. AND HE ASKED PEOPLE IN THE AUDIENCE TO TRANSLATE THE TWO WORDS, AND I AT THE TIME VOLUNTEERED. WELL, AT THE TIME, OTHER PEOPLE WERE SAYING, "GO AHEAD, PAT. GO ON UP THERE AND TRY TO DO IT," AND I THOUGHT, "ALL RIGHT, I'LL TRY," AND I MADE A LOT OF EXCUSES WHY, AND I SAID, "I'LL TRY." YOU KNOW, THERE ARE MANY, MANY SIGNS THAT CAN SHOW THE MEANING OF BOTH THESE WORDS. BUT THE TWO SIGNS THAT I THINK ARE-- TO COME UP WITH TWO SIGNS EQUIVALENT TO THOSE, IT'S REALLY IMPOSSIBLE, AND ALLEN AT THE TIME SAID, "GO AHEAD, JUST TRY ANYWAY," SO, THIS IS WHAT I SIGNED. YOU PUT THE MONEY IN, YOU PRESS THE BUTTON, THE RECORD COMES OUT AND COMES DOWN, THEN THE ARM OF THE RECORD COMES DOWN AND THE MUSIC STARTS TO PLAY. AND IT GETS LOUDER AND LOUDER AND LOUDER UNTIL THE RECORD ACTUALLY FLIES OFF IN THE JUKE BOX AND BREAKS. AND ALLEN SAID, "THAT'S WONDERFUL. "IT'S VERY EQUIVALENT TRANSLATION. YOU CAUGHT THE MEANING." AND AT THE TIME, I THOUGHT, "WOW, THAT'S--THAT'S GREAT." WELL, AFTER THE CLASS, I GOT TOGETHER WITH A HEARING PERSON NAMED JIM COHN, WHO WORKED HERE BEFORE. HE WAS ALSO A POET HIMSELF. AND WE WERE ENCOURAGED TO SET UP A CLASS CALLED "A BIRD BRAIN'S SOCIETY," AND WHAT WE WOULD DO IS WE WOULD SIGN OUR POEMS, AND...IN THE CELLAR OF THE RITZ, WHICH WAS A BAR AT THE TIME, OR IN THE DORMS, IT WAS A BAR IN THE DORMITORIES, AND THERE WAS ALSO A COFFEE HOUSE, A RESTAURANT CALLED THE JAZZ--JAZZBERRY'S, WHICH IS LOCATED IN DOWNTOWN ROCHESTER, WHERE WE HELD THIS ALSO, AND THAT WENT ON FROM '85 AND IT'S STILL CONTINUING TODAY, AND THAT'S--IT'S BECOME HISTORY NOW. IT'S STILL GOING ON. IF YOU HAVE QUESTIONS OF IT THAT POP UP, ABOUT THE HISTORY OF IT, THE BIRD BRAIN'S SOCIETY AND JAZZBERRY'S AND SO FORTH, YOU CAN ASK ME LATER ABOUT THAT. NOW I'D LIKE TO MOVE ON TO MY NEXT TOPIC-- ASL AND THE ANALYZATION OF IT IN THE CLASSIFIERS. I KNOW SOME OF YOU ARE ALREADY FAMILIAR WITH IT, BUT I THINK WE SHOULD HAVE A REVIEW FIRST OF ALL. DR. STOKOE HIMSELF, IN THE PROCESS OF ANALYZING ASL AND ANALYZING EACH SIGN, NOTICED THAT SIGNS THEMSELVES CAN BE BROKEN UP INTO-- THEY HAVE 3 DISTINCT CATEGORIES WITHIN A SIGN. THE FIRST IS THE HANDSHAPE. THE SECOND CATEGORY IS CALLED THE LOCATION, WHERE THE--WHERE THE SIGN IS MADE IN LOCATION TO THE BODY. THE THIRD IS MOVEMENT. THEN, LATER ON, IN 1975... ADDISON ADDED A FOURTH CATEGORY, WHICH WAS PALM ORIENTATION. WELL, I'LL GIVE YOU ONE SIGN AS AN EXAMPLE. THE SIGN FOR "HELLO." FIRST OF ALL, THIS IS THE HANDSHAPE. IT HAS A "B" HANDSHAPE. NOW, THE LOCATION WHERE THE SIGN IS MADE, IT STARTS FROM THE HEAD AND MOVES OUTWARD. THE MOVEMENT ITSELF, THIS IS THE MOVEMENT THAT'S USED, AND THEN THE PALM ORIENTATION. YOU NOTICE WHERE MY PALM IS POINTING. IT'S NOT POINTING AWAY FROM ME. [INDISTINCT] IT'S AWKWARD. IT'S NOT POINTING DOWN. IT'S POINTING DIAGONALLY. AND THAT WAS HIS--HOW HE ANALYZED EACH SIGN. NOW, A POET--WELL, FIRST LET ME PUT THAT ON HOLD. I HAVE TO DISCUSS SOMETHING ABOUT SIGNING AND POETRY--THE SIGN FOR "POEM" ITSELF. THIS IS THE SIGN FOR "POETRY." HOW THAT SIGN WAS DEVELOPED, IT WAS DEVELOPED OVER MANY YEARS AND IT WAS DEVELOPED FROM THE ENGLISH. ASL POETRY REALLY WANTED TO HAVE A DISTINCTION FROM HEARING POETRY, SO, THEY TRIED TO COME UP WITH THIS SIGN, OR THEY THOUGHT MAYBE THEY COULD SHOW THIS, MEANING POETRY. AND THERE WERE A VARIETY OF DIFFERENT SUGGESTIONS ON HOW TO SIGN THAT, AND FINALLY, IT WAS AGREED UPON TO PICK ONE SIGN AS THE SIGN FOR ASL POETRY. WE HAVEN'T REALLY DONE THAT YET, BUT WE'RE--WE'RE STILL TENDING TO USE THE SIGN, EVEN THOUGH IT'S BEEN DERIVED FROM ENGLISH. SO, THIS SIGN FOR "POETRY" IS USED TO DESCRIBE BOTH ASL AND ENGLISH POETRY. OK, SO, I WAS TALKING ABOUT THE SIGN FOR "HELLO." OH--OK, NOW I REMEMBER WHAT I WAS LEADING INTO. NOW, DEAF POETS TENDED TO USE THE 4 CLASS--THE 4 CATEGORIES, BUT THEY WOULD PLAY ON THOSE, AND THE DEAF COMMUNITY REALLY TENDED TO PLAY ON THESE 4-- 4 CATEGORIES, SUCH AS, FOR EXAMPLE, THE ABC STORIES THAT YOU'VE SEEN, LIKE "A" FOR KNOCKING AT THE DOOR, THE LETTER "B" FOR OPENING THE DOOR, "C," ENJOY LISTENING, AND THEY WOULD USE EACH LETTER OF THE ALPHABET IN A SIGN AND PLAY ON THAT DURING THE ABC STORIES. NOW, DEAF POETS LOOKED AT THAT ELEMENT OF THE DEAF COMMUNITY AND HOW THEY PLAYED WITH THE SIGNS AND THE LETTERS AND THE SHAPES, AND THEY THOUGHT, WELL, THAT HAS RULES THAT HAVE TO BE FOLLOWED. NOW, WHO DECIDES ON THE RULES? WE HAVEN'T REALLY DISCOVERED THAT YET. REALLY, EACH POET HIMSELF WILL TEND TO DEVELOP AND USE HIS OWN RULES, HIS OR HER OWN RULES. NOW, MAYBE SOMEDAY WE'LL HOLD A CONFERENCE AND WE WILL BE ABLE TO SET UP A DEFINITE LIST OF RULES FOR ALL POETS TO BE ABLE TO USE, BUT AT THIS TIME, THAT ISN'T BEING DONE. EACH POET TENDS TO USE THEIR OWN RULES. BUT REALLY, WHAT POETS SHOULD DO IS THEY-- THEY PLAY WITH THE HANDSHAPES. I HAVE ANOTHER EXAMPLE I'D LIKE TO SHOW YOU AT THIS TIME. FOR EXAMPLE, THE "5" HANDSHAPE. I WILL CREATE SOMETHING RIGHT NOW TO SHOW YOU WHAT I MEAN BY THIS. FOR EXAMPLE, THIS IS A "5" HANDSHAPE USING THE BASE FOR A TREE, AND THEN CONTINUING WITH THAT HANDSHAPE INTO A RIVER, AND THEN THE SUN COMING UP, AND THE RAYS FROM THE SUN, AND THE WIND, AND THE TREE BLOWING IN THE WIND. THAT'S A POEM, ALL MADE WITH THE SAME HANDSHAPE, THE "5" HANDSHAPE. AND DEAF POETS TEND TO PLAY A LOT WITH HANDSHAPE WHEN THEY'RE CREATING ORIGINAL POETRY. BOY, TIME IS GOING SO FAST. I WANTED TO DISCUSS THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE DOMINANT HAND OR NON-DOMINANT, THE STRONG OR WEAK HANDS. THE SIGN--THE HAND THAT YOU WRITE WITH, YOUR RIGHT HAND IF YOU'RE RIGHT-HANDED, IS YOUR STRONG HAND, AND THEN YOUR LEFT WOULD BE YOUR WEAK HAND IF YOU WERE RIGHT-HANDED. IN OTHER WORDS, DOMINANT. YOUR DOMINANT HAND. AND THEN YOUR SUPPORTIVE HAND OR YOUR NON-DOMINANT HAND. PEOPLE WHO ARE LEFT-HANDED, THE LEFT HAND WOULD BE THEIR DOMINANT OR STRONG HAND, AND THEIR RIGHT WOULD BE THEIR WEAK HAND. IS THAT CLEAR? FOR EXAMPLE, THE SIGN FOR "HELP." THE WEAK HAND IS JUST SUPPORTING THE RIGHT HAND--THE STRONG HAND WITH THIS SIGN. THERE ARE RULES PERTAINING TO STRONG AND WEAK HANDS. IF THE RIGHT HAND IS MOVING AND THE STRONG HAND IS MOVING, THE WEAK HAND WILL FOLLOW. FOR EXAMPLE, THE WIND. YOU NOTICE THE TWO HANDS ARE FOLLOWING THE SAME MOVEMENT. THE SIGN FOR "SUCCESS." THAT'S ONE SIGN. THE SAME HANDSHAPE, AND THE MOVEMENT IS FOLLOWING THE DOMINANT HAND. THEY'RE BOTH MOVING IN THE SAME DIRECTION. POINTING TO THIS, THE WEAK HAND IS JUST SUPPORTING THE MOTION. THE RIGHT HAND IS DOING THE MOTION. CAN YOU THINK OF ANY OTHER EXAMPLES? "EXAMPLE" IS A SIGN THAT-- THE WEAK HAND IS JUST SUPPORTING THE MOVEMENT OF THE RIGHT HAND. AND DEAF POETS... BROKE THAT RULE. SIGN LANGUAGE HAS A SPECIFIC RULE, BUT IN POETRY, YOU CAN USE RIGHT OR LEFT. IT DOESN'T MATTER. IT DOESN'T MATTER IF IT'S A DOMINANT OR A WEAK HAND. YOU FLIP BACK AND FORTH FOR POETIC REASONS, AND I WILL EXPLAIN THOSE MORE IN DETAIL IN A MOMENT. CLASSIFIERS IS ANOTHER FEATURE OF ASL. AND MAYBE MOST OF YOU ARE AWARE THAT IT'S SIMILAR TO AN ADJECTIVE IN ENGLISH. IT SERVES A SIMILAR FUNCTION. SOMETIMES, AN ADVERB OR A PRONOUN ARE DIFFERENT ENGLISH-- GRAMMATICAL FEATURES THAT CLASSIFIERS TAKE UP IN AMERICAN SIGN LANGUAGE. FOR EXAMPLE, THIS HANDSHAPE IS A PERSON WALKING. IT DOESN'T SAY IF THERE'S A WOMAN OR A MAN, SO, YOU WOULD HAVE TO SAY, "WOMAN," AND THEN MOVE THIS HAND INTO A CLASSIFYING MOVEMENT. ASL POETS LOVE TO USE CLASSIFIERS SO MUCH. ASL DEPENDS ON FACIAL EXPRESSION TO SHOW FEELINGS. HOWEVER... WITHIN THE RULES OF ASL, THERE ARE CERTAIN RULES. FOR EXAMPLE, RAISING YOUR EYEBROWS IS SHOWING THAT THERE'S A QUESTION. THERE'S A RHETORICAL QUESTION. HAS THE SPECIFIC RULES OF AMERICAN SIGN LANGUAGE. IN ASL POETRY, HOWEVER, FACIAL EXPRESSION IS REALLY USED MINIMALLY, MINIMALLY, AND THEY'RE MUCH MORE PLAYFUL WITH THE ACTUAL MOVEMENT OF THE SIGNS, AND FACIAL EXPRESSION DOES NOT PLAY AS AN IMPORTANT PART AS IT DOES IN AMERICAN SIGN LANGUAGE. ON A SIMILAR NOTE, IF YOU LISTEN TO ENGLISH POETRY, SOMETIME, THE MEANING, THE VOICE IS NOT FOLLOWING THE MEANING. YOU'RE NOT USING A CONVERSATIONAL AS SPOKEN IN ENGLISH, AND THAT MAY BE A COMPARISON WITH HOW AMERICAN SIGN LANGUAGE IS USED IN POETRY. YOU--DEAF POETS ARE USING AMERICAN SIGN LANGUAGE, BUT MIGHT NOT BE USING FACIAL EXPRESSION, AND THE MEANING WOULD BE MORE OBSCURE. SPACE IS VERY IMPORTANT FOR DEAF POETS ESPECIALLY. THEY USE THE FEATURE OF SPACE VERY MUCH IN THEIR USE OF ASL POETRY. DEAF POETS LOVE TO PLAY WITH FINGERSPELLING. JUST LOVE IT. I'LL GIVE YOU ONE EXAMPLE. I HAVE A POET--POEM THAT I'D LIKE TO PRESENT. I'LL LET YOU LOOK AT THIS FOR JUST A FEW MINUTES AND THEN I WILL PRESENT IT. REFLECTION. 5, 4, 3, 2, 1. THE LIFTOFF OF THE "CHALLENGER" INSPIRED ME. ONE MINUTE AND 45 SECONDS LATER, EXPLOSION. MY HEART HALTED. THE MAIN SHUTTLE DESCENDED AND DEPRESSED ME. IT DAWNED UPON ME IN 1963. PRESIDENT KENNEDY WAS SHOT. HIS BODY BENT, A TEARDROP. THANK YOU. DID YOU SEE THE ASL FEATURES USED IN THAT POEM? I INCLUDED FINGERSPELLING, ACTUALLY, NUMBERS, AND USED THAT WITH MY WEAK HAND, MY LEFT HAND. MY DOMINANT HAND IS MY RIGHT HAND, BUT I DID NOT USE THAT FOR THE FINGERSPELLING OF THE NUMBERS, THE COUNTDOWN. AND THE REASON FOR THAT IS BECAUSE I WANTED TO ESTABLISH THIS AREA AS THE SPACE SHUTTLE AREA FOR THE ACTION IN THAT. THE NEXT TIME YOU SEE NUMBERS IN THE POEM IS AS--IS REPRESENTING THE MINUTES GOING BY AS THE SHUTTLE WAS GOING UP. I'M STILL NOT USING MY RIGHT HAND. MY NUMBERS ARE PLACED IN A HIGHER LOCATION BECAUSE THAT'S WHERE THE SHUTTLE IS AT THE TIME. ONE MINUTE, 49 SECONDS. I WANTED TO INCLUDE THE MOTION AND THE PLACEMENT OF THE SHUTTLE IN THE POEM. THE THIRD NUMBER IS THE DATE 1963. THAT'S PLACED OVER HERE AND TO THE BACK, BECAUSE IT'S BEING-- IT'S MENTIONING SOMETHING THAT'S HAPPENED IN THE PAST. IN EVERYDAY CONVERSATION, WE WOULDN'T DO THAT. WE WOULDN'T PUT A DATE BEHIND US BECAUSE IT HAPPENED IN THE PAST. YOU WOULD JUST SAY, "A LONG TIME AGO, IN 1963," AND PUT IT IN THE PAST TENSE. SO, AS YOU CAN SEE, WE ARE PLAYING WITH THE RULES OF AMERICAN SIGN LANGUAGE. I PLANNED TO USE THE LEFT HAND, AND IN EVERYDAY CONVERSATION, DEAF PEOPLE WOULD NOT PLAN TO USE A LEFT HAND OR A RIGHT HAND. AND THIS IS HOW-- THAT IS JUST THE TENDENCY. WE TEND TO PLAN--TO SIGN WITH OUR STRONG HANDS. AS WE'RE CREATING POETRY, WE DO CHANGE THE RULES TO CREATE CERTAIN EFFECTS. SETTING THE DATE IN THE PAST, SETTING THE SHUTTLE ACTION IN THE ONE AREA. AS YOU NOTICE, I'M USING TWO HANDS. THE ROCKET IS GOING UP AND I'M BEING INSPIRED. THE TWO DIFFERENT SIGNS, TWO DIFFERENT HANDSHAPES AT THE SAME TIME, AND IT'S STILL SUCCESSFUL. YOU NOTICE WITH THE SIGN "WIND," THEY'RE BOTH THE SAME HANDSHAPE MOVING. HERE, THEY'RE TWO DIFFERENT MOVEMENTS, TWO DIFFERENT HANDSHAPES MOVING AT THE SAME TIME. ALSO, AS THE EXPLOSION OF THE SHUTTLE GOES OFF, I'M SHOCKED, AND THAT-- THOSE TWO SIGNS ARE HAPPENING AT THE SAME TIME. AND THAT'S FOR EFFECT. THE TWO DIFFERENT HANDSHAPES AND TWO DIFFERENT MOTIONS IN BOTH THOSE SIGNS, AND BREAKING THAT RULE OF MOTION IN TWO--THE DOMINANT AND NON-DOMINANT HANDS. AS THE SHUTTLE COME--AS THE BODY BENDS OF THE PRESIDENT, MY TEARDROP FALLS AT THE SAME TIME. I HAVE SEVERAL POEMS, BUT I DON'T THINK TIME IS NOT GOING TO ALLOW US TO GO THROUGH ALL OF THEM. IF YOU WANT TO SEE SOME OF THE DIFFERENT POETRY THAT I HAVE, I HAVE A VIDEOTAPE THAT'S FOR SALE. IT'S CALLED "POETRY IN MOTION." I HAVE 3, 3 POEMS THERE. ONE IS CALLED--OH, THERE ARE 3 POETS INCLUDED IN THIS-- DEBBIE REDDY, CLAYTON VALLI, AND MYSELF. AND HOPEFULLY, AS THIS TIME GOES ON, WE CAN COLLECT MORE POEMS AND MAKE FURTHER VIDEOTAPES. NOW, WHAT I'VE BEEN DISCUSSING SO FAR HAS FOCUSED ON ASL, FEATURES OF ASL, AND COMPARING DEAF POETRY WITH THE ANALYSIS OF ASL AS A LANGUAGE. IF WE HAD TIME, REALLY, IF WE HAD MORE THAN AN HOUR, WE COULD ALSO TALK ABOUT MAYBE PSYCHOLOGICAL ASPECTS OF IT, AND ONE OF MY POEMS IS A GOOD EXAMPLE. IT'S CALLED "PARADOX." AND IT'S TALKING ABOUT MYSELF WATCHING A BLACK SINGER SING MUSIC. NOW, I MYSELF REALLY DIDN'T KNOW WHAT THE SONG WAS ABOUT, BUT THE TITLE OF HIS SONG WAS "WHERE IS THE MAN?" SO, I WATCHED HIM, AND THEN LATER ON, I--I TALKED ABOUT MYSELF AND MY MOTHER, WHO WAS A--MY MOTHER WAS A HEARING PERSON. SHE--SHE CAN SIGN SOMEWHAT. SHE'S NOT FLUENT BUT SHE CAN SIGN. AND MY FATHER, WHO'S HEARING, CANNOT SIGN. AND I COMPARED THEM. IT WAS A PSYCHOLOGICAL POEM COMPARING THE TWO OF THEM. AND THE SONG THAT THIS MAN WAS SINGING WAS ALL DONE--IT WAS IN BLACK AND WHITE, AND I MYSELF, WHEN I PRESENTED MY OWN POEM, WAS DRESSED IN BLACK AND WHITE AND USED THE COLORS TO ALSO TALK ABOUT PSYCHOLOGICAL ASPECTS. NOW, WHAT I SEE HAPPENING IN ASL POETRY IN THE FUTURE, MY OWN FEELINGS ON IT, IS FIRST OF ALL, I THINK DEAF POETS WILL INFLUENCE DEAF PEOPLE IN THE DEAF COMMUNITY MORE AND MORE AS TIME GOES ON. I THINK THE DEAF COMMUNITY WILL SEE THE DEAF POETS PLAYING WITH THE RULES AND BEING MORE CREATIVE WITH POETRY AND ADDING--AND I THINK AT THAT TIME, PROBABLY MORE RULES AS FAR AS THE ASL LANGUAGE WILL BE DEVELOPED OR WILL BE DISCOVERED. I ALSO FEEL--SO, I FEEL THAT WILL BE ONE EVENT THAT WILL HAPPEN IN THE FUTURE. NOW, AUTHORSHIP. AT THIS TIME, ASL IS NOT-- DOES NOT HAVE A WRITTEN SYSTEM. DEAF PEOPLE WILL PRESENT IT IN A VISUAL WAY, BUT OFTENTIMES, WHEN WE'RE-- IT'S BEING USED WITH A VOICE INTERPRETER, WE WONDER, WELL, WHAT--WHAT WORDS ARE THE INTERPRETERS USING? AND THERE'S A REAL STRUGGLE GOING ON AND A REAL CONFLICT SOMETIMES BETWEEN THE TWO LANGUAGES. SO, IT SEEMS THAT HEARING PEOPLE HAVE A HARD TIME WATCHING DEAF POETRY IN ASL AND THEN FINDING APPROPRIATE ENGLISH WORDS TO USE. WHAT GOES ON IN THEIR MINDS TO BE ABLE TO DO THAT? BECAUSE POETS THEMSELVES OFTEN MIGHT NOT BE CLEAR. SO, THERE'S A REAL STRUGGLE WITH INTERPRETING AND WHAT TO DO. SO, REALLY, WHAT WE NEED TO HAVE IS A WRITTEN SYSTEM FOR ASL, OR A WRITTEN SYSTEM THAT CAN BE USED WITH ENGLISH, SO, THEN, IF HEARING PEOPLE, SUCH AS LINGUISTS OR INTERPRETERS, WATCH A DEAF POET PRESENT, THEY ARE ABLE TO DO AN ANALYSIS, WRITE THAT DOWN, SHOW THAT TO THE DEAF POET, AND THEN THE DEAF POET CAN GIVE THEIR APPROVAL FOR THEIR TRANSLATION. OR THEY CAN TRY AND MAKE A TRANSLATION THEMSELVES IN A SECOND LANGUAGE, WHICH WOULD BE ASL FOR THEM. SO, REALLY, I THINK THIS REQUIRES DEAF AND HEARING PEOPLE BOTH WORKING TOGETHER TO COME UP WITH A WRITTEN SYSTEM. THIRDLY... THIRDLY, VIDEOTAPING NEEDS TO BECOME MORE WIDESPREAD. I THINK AS MORE AND MORE VIDEOTAPES ARE IN USE AND BECOME SPREAD-- AND WIDESPREAD, IT WILL REALLY HELP-- HELP THE PROLIFERATION OF ASL POETRY AS WE HAVE A FILE OR A LIBRARY OF ASL POEMS AND ASL STORIES. I THINK VIDEOTAPING IS REALLY A BLESSING FOR THE DEVELOPMENT OF ASL, AS I THINK AS VIDEOTAPES ARE DEVELOPED MORE AND MORE, ASL POETRY WILL BE ABLE TO BE KEPT IN FILES. IN '85, I THINK IT WAS IN 1985, OR IN--ACTUALLY, 1885-- OR IN 1985, THERE WAS--THE FIRST ASL POETRY CONFERENCE WAS HELD HERE. IT WAS AN ASL LIT CONFERENCE THAT RECENTLY HAPPENED THIS PAST OCTOBER. SO, I THINK AS MORE AND MORE CONFERENCES RELATED TO ASL POETRY HAPPENS, INFORMATION AND IDEAS WILL BE ABLE TO BE SHARED, AND I THINK THAT WILL REALLY SPREAD AND INFLUENCE PEOPLE, AND ALSO, I THINK IT WILL INFLUENCE MORE COURSEWORK TO BE ESTABLISHED FOR PEOPLE TO STUDY POETRY AND STUDY ASL. I THINK IT WILL HELP IN INTERPRETER TRAINING FOR THOSE STUDENTS TO BE ABLE TO LEARN THE LANGUAGE AND I THINK IT WILL HELP LINGUISTS THEMSELVES TO BETTER ANALYZE ASL AS A LANGUAGE. ALSO, TEACHERS OF ASL WILL BE ABLE TO USE ASL POETRY TO SHOW ASL, ITS MEANING, ITS PURPOSE, AND SO FORTH. WELL, I THINK THAT'S THE END OF MY FORMAL PRESENTATION. IF ANYONE WOULD LIKE TO ASK ME SOME QUESTIONS AT THIS POINT, I WILL TRY MY BEST TO ANSWER THEM. ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS THAT YOU HAVE FOR ME? WELL, I REALLY--I HAVE ABOUT 5 OR 6-- 5 OR 6 MINUTES LEFT. HOW LONG HAVE YOU BEEN STUDYING POETRY BEFORE YOU ACTUALLY BEGAN TRANSLATION INTO ASL? SO, YOU'RE ASKING ME HOW LONG IS IT THAT I STUDIED POETRY, ENGLISH POETRY BEFORE I WAS--OR HOW LONG IT TAKES ME TO STUDY AN ENGLISH POEM BEFORE I CAN TRANSLATE IT? WELL, I STARTED AS A SMALL BOY, ACTUALLY. NOW, I CAME FROM A FAMILY OF 7 CHILDREN. 5 OF THEM WERE HEARING. WAIT, WAIT A MINUTE. 5 OF THEM WERE DEAF AND TWO WERE HEARING. THE TWO MIDDLE CHILDREN WERE HEARING. MY PARENTS ARE BOTH HEARING. AND WHEN I WAS BORN, MY TWO OLDER SISTERS WERE TEENAGERS AT THE TIME, SO, THEY REALLY TAUGHT ME A LOT AS FAR AS TRANSLATING THINGS. SO, I FEEL THAT I'VE-- I'VE REALLY DEVELOPED MY SKILL IN TRANSLATION OVER THE YEARS, STARTING FROM A SMALL BOY. THERE WAS A QUESTION WAY IN THE BACK? OK, HE ASKED ME A QUESTION ABOUT HOW I FEEL ABOUT HAVING VOICE INTERPRETERS SPEAKING WHILE I'M PRESENTING MY POETRY. HOW I FEEL ABOUT THAT. TO BE HONEST...I FEEL A LITTLE...AWKWARD WITH IT. I FEEL A LITTLE UNCOMFORTABLE. I HAVEN'T HAD ANY, REALLY, PROBLEMS THAT HAVEN'T BEEN ABLE TO BE SOLVED, NO, BUT... IT'S A REALLY NEW FIELD. IT'S BEEN GOING ON ABOUT 10 YEARS OR SO, I THINK, SO, I REALLY THINK WE NEED TO HAVE MORE CONFERENCES JUST TO DISCUSS THAT ISSUE OF INCORPORATING THE VOICE INTERPRETING WITH THE DEAF POETS, AND I REALLY THINK THAT WILL SOLVE THE PROBLEMS. I THINK PROBABLY THAT THE INTERPRETERS THEMSELVES FEEL A LITTLE BIT AWKWARD IN FITTING IN WHAT THEY'RE DOING WITH WHAT THE DEAF POETS ARE PRESENTING. SO, I THINK, AGAIN, THE MORE CONFERENCES WE HAVE, THE MORE EXCHANGE OF IDEAS, THAT PROBLEM WILL BE SOLVED. QUESTION HERE. IF--IF A PERSON IS--IS AWARE OF ASL, OF ITS RULES, DO YOU THINK THAT PERSON, JUST BECAUSE THEY'RE FAMILIAR WITH THE LANGUAGE AND THE RULES, CAN TEACH DEAF POETRY AND ASL POETRY? THE QUESTION WAS, IF A PERSON KNOWS ASL, HAS LEARNED IT, SO, IS AWARE OF THE RULES, BUT DOESN'T HAVE ANY EXPERIENCE IN THE DEAF WORLD, SHOULD THEY BE TEACHING ASL POETRY? HMM. THAT'S NOT AN EASY QUESTION TO ANSWER. FIRST OF ALL... THE TOPIC ITSELF... ABOUT TEACHING ASL AS A COURSE, FIRST OF ALL, I THINK THE PERSON NEEDS TO KNOW ASL OR NEEDS TO KNOW THE CONTENT VERY WELL, AND THEY ALSO, TO BE A GOOD TEACHER, THEY ALSO HAVE TO EXPERIENCE IT. I THINK THE EXPERIENCE-- I THINK A DEAF PERSON REALLY IS BEST TO TEACH IT, BECAUSE THEY KNOW THE LANGUAGE AND THEY HAVE THE EXPERIENCE OF BEING DEAF. THEY HAVE THAT--THE GUT FEELING OF KNOWING WHAT IT-- WHAT IT'S LIKE TO BE DEAF, SO, I THINK THOSE ARE THE BEST PEOPLE TO TEACH COURSES IN ASL. NOW, THERE ARE A NUMBER OF-- THERE AREN'T THAT MANY DEAF POETS. SO, AS A SECOND CHOICE, I THINK MAYBE TEAM TEACHING BETWEEN A DEAF AND A HEARING PERSON WOULD BE BEST AS A SECOND CHOICE. MAYBE ONE PERSON MIGHT BE VERY KNOWLEDGEABLE AND SKILLED IN TRANSLATING POEMS SUCH AS FRENCH TO ENGLISH OR SO FORTH TO HEARING PERSON. IF THE HEARING PERSON WERE TO TEACH DEAF PEOPLE THEMSELVES ON HOW TO... TO ACTUALLY READ AND TRANSLATE, AND I DON'T THINK A DEAF PERSON-- A HEARING PERSON CAN DO THAT 100% HIMSELF. HE WOULD NEED TO HAVE SOMEONE DEAF TO BE ABLE TO TEAM-TEACH IT TO BE THE MOST EFFECTIVE WAY. WERE THERE ANY MORE QUESTIONS? I HAVE EXPERIENCE WITH THEATER MYSELF AND I'VE SEEN SOMETIMES [INDISTINCT]. OK. THE COMMENT WAS MADE THAT THIS PERSON FEELS THAT A POET REALLY USES A LOT LESS FACIAL EXPRESSION, AND SHE--SHE DISAGREES WITH THAT. SHE'S SEEN MANY POETS THAT SHE THINKS THEY TEND TO OVERDO THE FACIAL EXPRESSION IN THE PRESENTATION OF THEIR POEMS. WELL, THAT'S--THAT'S YOUR OPINION, AND I HAVE TO RESPECT YOUR OPINION. I MYSELF FEEL THAT THE FACIAL EXPRESSION IS REALLY REDUCED GREATLY COMPARED WITH EVERYDAY CONVERSATIONAL ASL. THE POETS TEND TO BE MORE FORMAL IN THEIR PRESENTATIONS. ARE YOU FAMILIAR WITH THE TERM "REGISTER"? THE REGISTERS OF ASL? NOW, THE ONE REGISTER "INTIMATE" MEANS YOU USE IT WITH A VERY CASUAL-- CASUAL FRIEND, AND...THERE'S A LOT OF-- A LOT OF FACIAL EXPRESSION IS NOT NECESSARY. AND THEN IN THE MORE INFORMAL, THE CASUAL, YOU USE A LITTLE MORE, AND THEN WITH THE CONSULTATIVE REGISTER, MAYBE YOU MIGHT GO TO SEE A LAWYER OR A TEACHER OR A PRINCIPAL, HAVE A MEETING WITH SOMEONE, THAT TYPE OF DIALOGUE. IT'S A LITTLE MORE FORMAL. IT'S MORE FORMAL THAN CASUAL. THEN, THE FORMAL REGISTER IS USED FOR MAYBE FORMAL PRESENTATIONS IN CHURCH AND SO FORTH, AND THEN THE LAST REGISTER IS CALLED "FROZEN," SUCH AS ESTABLISHED PRAYERS OR, FOR EXAMPLE, ROBERT'S RULES OF ORDER. SOMETHING THAT'S VERY SET. THE PLEDGE TO THE FLAG. A FROZEN STYLE. SO, YOU CAN SEE THE DIFFERENCE FROM--FROM FORMAL DOWN TO CONSULTATIVE. AS YOU MOVE--AS YOU MOVE IN THE REGISTERS TO THE MORE FORMAL, THERE IS LESS FACIAL EXPRESSION, BUT AS YOU MOVE DOWN TO THE MORE INTIMATE LEVELS, THEY--THERE IS--THERE IS A REAL CHANGE OF HOW MUCH OR HOW LITTLE FACIAL EXPRESSION IS USED. SO, I THINK ITSELF, THE DEAF POETS PRESENT IN A MORE FORMAL STYLE, SO, THEY WOULD USE LESS FACIAL EXPRESSION. QUESTION IN THE BACK. HOW DOES POETIC LICENSE APPLY TO ASL POETRY? YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT PLAYING IT ON SIGNS. IS THAT THE SAME THING AS POETIC LICENSE? SHE WAS TALKING ABOUT AN ENGLISH TERM, WHICH IS CALLED POETIC LICENSE. THAT MEANS THEY MIGHT BE ABLE TO CHANGE AND BEND THE RULES A LITTLE BIT. THAT'S PERMITTED. NOW SHE'S ASKING ABOUT DEAF POETS, HOW THEY PLAY WITH THE LANGUAGE. REALLY, IT'S THE SAME THING. YOU COULD CALL IT POETIC LICENSE IN ASL POETRY, BEING ABLE TO BEND AND CHANGE THE RULES. IT'S--IT'S A VERY SIMILAR THING RELATED TO THE ENGLISH. I HAVE TIME FOR ONE MORE QUESTION. [MAN SPEAKING INDISTINCTLY] WH--WHERE DO YOU MEAN? THE AMERICAN LIBRARY? [MAN SPEAKING INDISTINCTLY] OH, YES. YES. ALL RIGHT. THERE ARE TWO QUESTIONS HERE THAT I'VE JUST BEEN ASKED FROM A MAN THAT DOESN'T KNOW AMERICAN SIGN LANGUAGE, BUT... WE HAVE THE INTERPRETERS HERE THAT-- I JUST HEARD--SAW THE QUESTION. HE'D LIKE TO SIT DOWN AND TALK WITH ME, AND PLEASE SEE ME AFTER THIS PRESENTATION AND I WILL GIVE YOU MY PHONE NUMBER AND YOU CAN CALL AND MAKE AN APPOINTMENT WITH ME, OR--AND WE CAN GET AN INTERPRETER FOR THAT TIME AND THE 3 OF US CAN SIT DOWN AND TALK TOGETHER. SECOND, YOU HAD A QUESTION ABOUT THE AMERICAN POETIC LIBRARY, AND THERE'S--WONDERFUL LIBRARY WITH VIDEOTAPES AND RECORDINGS WITH ENGLISH POETRY. AND HE WAS ASKING IF THERE ARE DEAF POETS INVOLVED-- INCLUDED IN THAT LIBRARY, AND I REALLY DOUBT THAT. AT THIS TIME, SIGN MEDIA, INCORPORATED IN WASHINGTON, DC, IS VIDEOTAPING DEAF POETS AND HAS BEEN DOING THAT, AND THEY CAN CERTAINLY SEND A COPY OF THOSE VIDEOTAPES TO THE AMERICAN POETIC LIBRARY. I THINK THAT WOULD BE A GOOD IDEA. I THINK I'D LIKE TO CONTACT MY FRIEND THAT'S INVOLVED IN THAT COMPANY AND SUGGEST THAT. THANK YOU FOR YOUR SUGGESTION. IT'S 2:00 NOW. I'D LIKE TO WRAP UP. AND THANK YOU FOR COMING. WE CAN CONTINUE THIS DISCUSSION IN ANOTHER ROOM, I BELIEVE, FIRST OF ALL. THIS IS A WONDERFUL LECTURE. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. I'M INSPIRED. I JUST ENJOY THIS VERY MUCH. THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR COMING. IF YOU HAVE ANY MORE QUESTIONS OR WANT TO DISCUSS MORE WITH PATRICK, WE CAN HAVE THIS OPPORTUNITY. NOW, LET ME SEE. I'VE FORGOTTEN THE ROOM NUMBER. SUSAN FISCHER, WHERE ARE YOU? IN THE ALUMNI ROOM IS WHERE WE'RE GOING TO BE MEETING. YOU CAN HAVE MORE TIME TO TALK WITH PATRICK FOR ABOUT AN HOUR. THERE'S ALSO SOME POP AND COOKIES THERE FOR THE RECEPTION, SO, I'LL SEE YOU THERE. THANK YOU!
Notes: 
"This project is supported by a Digitizing Hidden Collections grant from the Council on Library and Information Resources (CLIR). The grant program is made possible by funding from the Andrew W. Mellon Foundation."